Monday, January 24, 2011
Communist Manifesto question
Is Marx and Engels' description of capitalist society accurate? Defend your answer by referring specifically to a characteristic of capitalist society, as Marx and Engels describe it, and with specific reference to modern American (or other capitalist) society. Keep your response brief--a couple hundred words, tops. Feel free to respond to others' posts as well.
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Marx and Engels describe a capitalist society as one where the bourgeoisie "has left no other bond between man and man than naked self-interest and callous 'cash payment'" (61). They are saying that because of the demand for production, capitalism has placed a monetary value on workers. In this aspect of capitalism, Marx and Engels are correct. In modern capitalism, there is established a 'free market' that encourages innovation yet also necessitates rapid adjustments. In order to create income, a company must appeal to its customers. Furthermore, because this free market has disallowed monopolies, there is subsequently incredible competition between the now endless amounts of companies. Ultimately, this situation forces business owners (the bourgeoisie in this case) to rapidly adapt and modify their business in order to make their product more appealing. If a company is slow to adapt, like how Windows allowed Apple to catch up, then they lose money. It's sadly the reality of capitalism. Thus, because the priority of companies is fast production, workers must also be effective. If a worker is not helping the company to create revenue, then he/she is lost money and will be fired.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels view the capitalistic society as individualistic industrialists, morphing all civilizations into one, large, industrial and trading community. They write, "It compels all nations, on pain of extinction, to adopt the bourgeois mode of production...it creates a world in its own image," (64-65). At first glance, a world all united may seem appealing, but under further scrutiny, it strips each nation of its individual identity. Not only does the industrial society eat up natural resources, but also the variety of cultures. Modern America, a capitalistic society, is like a microcosm of what Marx and Engels describe how the world would be with capitalism. Known as the "melting pot," ethnicity is lost to the "watered-down" variation of itself. Within its borders, places like Chinatown exist, where people try to preserve their traditions and lifestyle, but the influence of the industrial mindset infiltrate into every part of America. After all, immigrants flock to America in promise of money, made possible through capitalism and industry. This aspect of capitalism is bittersweet. Marx and Engels write that with capitalism, "National one-sidedness and narrow-mindedness become more and more impossible," (64). People can collaborate and communicate with one another and develop together. They can learn from one another. But in the same token, they lose a part of themselves in the process.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels describe a capitalistic society as precariously inter-dependent within itself and with other countries. In many ways, they discuss various relationships within a society and outside of it too. They describe the proletariats as, "a class of laborers, who live only so long as they find work, and who find work only so long as their labor increases capital" (68). This description makes society seem very dependent, and if one class fails, another subsequently will too; it is a never ending cycle. Not only is there codependence within a society, but capitalism (according to Marx and Engels) causes various societies and even nations to become codependent. They write, "We have intercourse in every direction, universal inter-dependence of nations....Just as it has made the country dependent on the cities, so has it made barbarian and semi-under developed countries dependent on the civilized ones, nations of peasants on nations of bourgeois, the East on West" (64-65). Marx and Engels believe that a capitalistic society expands rapidly and therefore affects other places as well. As the society touches new countries, it consequently causes them to change and tries to engulf them (especially the weaker ones) into their grasp. While, pessimistic, Marx and Engels' view on capitalism is fairly accurate. Many of the problems they believe capitalism causes, have come to fruition in America. With the recent economic crash, the collapse of wall street caused many "proletariats" to loose their jobs, and are subsequently still out of work. Moreover, because America is a successful capitalistic society, many other nations are dependent on/with America. Therefore, various other countries collapsed due to America's situation. Although Marx and Engels do not address the benefits of a capitalist society, the negatives they present can be very detrimental to a society.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels describe the capitalist society as one that breeds a fixation with wealth and worth. This point seems to be true. In The Communist Manifesto, Marx and Engels state, “It has converted the physician, the lawyer, the priest, the poet, the man of science, into its paid wage laborers”(62). In a capitalist society where there are classes and unequal distribution of wealth amongst people certain people attain more power and wealth than others, that is just the nature of the system. What seems to occur once people attain this power is they want more of it, Marx and Engels even reference this in The Communist Manifesto. The way people obtain more power is through progress and industrialization. This is even true in today’s society. For example companies like Apple are always trying to make the “next big thing.” They constantly want to beat out their competitors so they can obtain more power and wealth. This progress leads to many important advancements but it also can cause greed. This is what Marx and Engels are saying in The Communist Manifesto. Often times a capitalist society can possess a certain degree of greed. For example take the recession. The recession was largely caused because of greed. With this being said, progress is part of any capitalistic society because the person who has less always wants to be the person who has more and the person that has more always wants to have even more, sometimes this progress is good but it also breeds a fixation with wealth that can lead to reducing everything and everyone to a dollar value.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels' description of a capitalist society is quite accurate, giving an in-depth analysis on the effects of this type of society. Discussing the way that technology has impacted the market Marx and Engels say, "Modern industry has established the world market...This market has given an immense development to commerce, to navigation, to communication by land" (60). This description suggests that industry dominates the world market, and that it has helped progress everyone. In a capitalist society, the market is dependent on supply and demand, which is solely determined by the people. In a way, Marx and Engels imply that this is a beneficial society because it helps society, as a whole, improve. However, the "supply and demand" market also has its disadvantages. In any society, some people are going to make more money, which leads to greed and the desire to be more. People always want to make more money than what they have, which is when a capitalist market is very dangerous. So the same driving force that creates progress, can also cause the market to collapse. This shows that while a capitalist economy can be extremely beneficial, at the same time it can be detrimental.
ReplyDeleteYou have some good responses here. I'd like to throw in a thought.
ReplyDeleteI'm struck that all of you (so far) seem to agree that Marx and Engels are accurate in their account of capitalist society. It's striking of course, because it means you're agreeing with Communists, which, in our society, is always a little surprising. I'm assuming that the class is not actually full of Communists, so I'm wondering where you and Marx/Engels part ways. Something to think about.
I too, agree with Marx and Engels as well as with the previous posts. As described in "Communist Manifesto", the rise of the bourgeois "Has sprouted from the ruins of feudal society". Due to an overpowering aristocracy, the bourgeois have been able to strengthen and expand. To Marx and Engels, with this "feudal society" capitalism was inevitable due to the rise of the bourgeoisie. Then, as said in previous posts, Capitalism, coupled with industry, was able to feed off a competitive environment and an ever-expanding market and take over. To answer Dr. Korfhages' question, what happens after complete expansion of Capitalism has occurred is where I think we "part ways". According to Marx and Engel the bourgeoisie will crumble: "But not only has the bourgeoisie forged the weapons that bring death to itself; it has also called into existence the men who are to wield those weapons—the modern working class—the proletarians". They believe with the rise of the bourgeoisie comes the rise of the working class. Eventually, the working class will rebel, due to poor working conditions caused by competition involved in Capitalism. Once the bourgeoisie collapses, all of society will collapse. Marx and Engels believe that Communism is the solution to avoiding this potential disaster. However, I think that Capitalism will continue to remain in control of society and allow progress. With a vast market to sell to and competition to constantly keep prices from either extreme, industry would prosper even at its peak. Furthermore, competition between industries will force companies to create a even better product than before. Capitalism also allows the chance of prosperity as well as failure. A Communist society would have too much control over industry; production would always stay at medium due to the lack of competition and advancement in technology would not occur. Finally, we can see in our society, which happens to be a capitalistic one, when working class rebellion does occurs, such as strikes and boycotts, it doesn’t lead to the demise of our entire society. It rather makes industry adapt and adjust to different conditions that are suitable for the workers.
ReplyDeleteI disagree with Marx and Engels view on capitalism. They describe the working class as "Owing to the extensive use of machinery and to division of labor, the work of the proletarians has lost all individual character, and, consequently, all charm for the workman. He becomes an appendage of the machine.." (69). I disagree with this statement. The working class has not become an appendage of the machine. Technology is rather just a tool that the working class uses to better itself. He also says that the working class has lost all individual character and I also disagree with this. The working class has not lost its character at all. Because of capitalism you can always go up there is no limit to how high you can go and where you have to be to get there. With enough hard work the working class can move up and succeed.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels claimed that a capitalist society "stripped of its halo every occupation hitherto honored and looked up to with reverent awe" (62). Their view of capitalism was a bit overly exaggerated; however it was, for the most part, accurate. The two philosophers believed that capitalist societies have “resolved personal worth into exchange value” (62). Our modern U.S. economy is dominated by free trade, which Marx and Engels refer to as “that single, unconscionable freedom” (62). A free economy allows citizens to become as rich as they can be. Therefore, Marx and Engels believed that men and women would want jobs for the sole purpose of acquiring the largest amount of money possible. This meant that sacred occupations like doctors, psychiatrists, priests, and teachers held a pecuniary value. Marx and Engels maintained that the value of a profession is only based on its earnings; thus, they believed that the importance of a solid ethical code was unnecessary. Accordingly, the philosophers believed that people would become doctors not for the benefit of humanity but exclusively to gain money for themselves. In our modern civilization people do take jobs wholly for the benefit of themselves in acquiring great profits: for example, “bookies” are men and women who obtain wealth by placing bets with other people which is entirely for the money. Also, some people look at being a doctor as merely an occupation, instead of a job that makes miracles happen.
ReplyDeleteIn relation to the modern capitalist society, I entirely disagree with Karl Marx and Friedrich Engel's point regarding their characterization of the bourgeois "class." First, they believe very strongly in the social causes of history, even beginning the entire Manifesto with the statement, "the history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles" (57). Maybe up until the lives of these two men there was only writing about social struggle, but in reality, this is certainly not the case, as seen in the French Revolution, where there are multiple factors including political, ideological, and financial causes to the Revolution. Even granting them their premise, they characterize the bourgeoisie as a specific "class," as if to say that it has its own interests and competes with other "classes" in a capitalist economy. This, at least in modern American terms, I believe to be false for the simple reason that there is much intermingling and social ascension and descension between economic states. Therefore, so set a "class," cannot exist since economic status is temporary and provisional, and set social classes can exist only if there are legal differences between groups of people predetermined by birth, especially in prerevolutionary France, where noblemen were by birth separated from other groups of people. Marx and Engels do correctly characterize the aspects of a economically and individualistically motivated society, such as when they say, "the bourgeoisie... has created more massive and more colossal productive forces than have all preceding generations together" (65). They emphasize a bourgeois takeover, which in some respects is correct, like today where we have an extremely powerful banking class, run by a small and select few very wealthy bankers. However, their constant negative outlook when discussing the bourgeois takeover of all global markets and of exploitation of the weak proletarian is inaccurate, especially by today's standards, because of the opportunity granted to workers and entrepreneurs to ascend the economic ladder. Modern American capitalism stresses individual economic freedom, wherein people are able to make choices about their economic pursuits. The market is consumer-based, so those who succeed are those who can provide for the free desire of the people. If anything, the "bourgeoisie" is not a defined class of people that is set in stone, it is merely the constantly changing and highly competitive network of successful businessmen who succeed on the basis of their providing for an economic desire of the people.
ReplyDeleteResponding to Dr. Korfhage's point, I think that those who agree with Marx and Engel agree with their characterization of the bourgeoisie, not the overall communist philosophy. At least for me, I believe their characterization of the bourgeois class and capitalism to be incorrectly framed and exaggerated; however, at some points there is merit to their argument. However, later, when they probably discuss their solution to the problem, better known as communism, I feel that more people will see the error in the Marxist philosophy, due to the wholly anti-meritocratic failed economic and social system.
ReplyDeleteAlthough Marx and Engels provide some valid points about a capitalistic society, I disagree that communism would provide a solution, rather I believe it would make situations worse. Marx and Engels state that "as repulsiveness of work increases, the wages decrease...in the same proportion the burden of toil also increases, whether by prolongation of the working hours, by the increase of the work exacted in a given time or by the increased speed of machinery, etc"(69). Through methods like boycotts and strikes workers in a capitalistic society have the ability to force change on conditions that they believe are unfair. In a communist society such privileges do not exist. Moreover, the quality of work will drop significantly after the switch to communism. Once there is no longer the fear of wages dropping if the quality of work does not remain high, there will no longer be a need for people to strive to produce the best products possible. Therefore quality of society will drop as well as any possible revenue for the poorly made products.
ReplyDeleteI believe Marx and Engels description of a capitalistic society to be inaccurate, specifically when they state that, "Modern bourgeois society, with its relations of production, of exchange and of property, a society that has conjured up such gigantic means of production and of exchange, is like the sorcerer who is no longer able to control the powers of the nether world whom he has called up by his spells." They suggest that the products of a capitalistic society, mainly huge production and a network of exchange, causes those involved to exercise very little control over the resulting society. This is inaccurate for the main reason that control is a fundamental part of capitalism. Firstly capitalism implies private ownership, which means people hold responsibility over their own property. The majority of Americans today survive due to the money generated by their job. They take such huge steps to secure and maintain their life source because they’re dependent on it. Inability to control the capitalistic society does not come because the products are uncontrollable, it comes from individuals who become lazy and oblivious to potential threats. For example, Lehman Brothers, the financial services firm which, filed for bankruptcy due to incompetence by it’s employees. They were negligent and as a result their company failed. Capitalistic production and exchange, no matter how big can always be controlled due to the fact that humans are dependent on their jobs and as such, will takes great strives to secure them.
ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels describe the capitalist society as one that consists of two groups; the exploiters and the exploited. They believe that capitalism is merely an evolved form of slavery, manipulated to suit the needs of the bourgeoisie. "Capitalist production, therefore, develops technology, and the combining together of various processes into a social whole, only by sapping the original sources of all wealth - the soil and the labourer" (Karl Marx). According to Marx, capitalist production only occurs when bourgeois business owners exploit the lower classes for their labor. Both Engels and Marx share this view of capitalism as a modern system of slavery, but they fail to see the freedom that capitalism gives to society. Although, with the existence of economic classes, some people will be more fortunate than others, the beauty of capitalism is that the individual can determine his or her own fate. With communism, no one has control over their economic earnings, which, to me seems more like slavery than capitalism. Marx and Engels's view on capitalism is inaccurate because it completely ignores the freedom and hope that capitalism gives to the individual. Also, capitalism simply does not exist in America to the extent to which Marx and Engels believed. Our government interferes with the economy with regulations like the Sherman and Clayton acts that prevent huge concentrations of power in the business world. More recently, the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act put into effect by president Obama further regulates our economy and protects consumers from the dangers of a capitalist society as understood by Marx and Engles. Essentially Marx and Engles overreacted to the dangers of capitalism, and were wrong to describe it simply as a system of exploitation of the lower classes.
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ReplyDeleteMarx and Engels believe that a capitalistic society consists of a society in which everyone is driven by greed and power; a society where "personal worth [turns] into exchange value" (62). Although I do agree with their description of capitalism, in that a desire for money, or "exchange value", is a negative driving force behind capitalism, I do not believe that communism is the proper solution to this problem like they do. I believe that the flaws of communism outweigh the flaws of capitalism, thus making capitalism a more effective system. One of biggest flaws of communism is a decreased desire to succeed, since everyone gets equal rewards and an oppressive ruling class. In my opinion, that flaw alone outweighs all of the flaws of capitalism that Marx and Engels pointed out.
ReplyDeleteAn example of a negative desire for wealth in modern society recently occurred with the people on wall street. Greed for money lead led to wall street's struggles. In a communist society something like this would not happen; however greater problems would arise.
I believe that the description of capitalism described here is accurate in some ways. A capitalist society that does not put any restrictions on those that control the means of production would have many of the problems that the Communist Manifesto describes. However, these problems are not systematic to capitalism, and can be prevented if the government regulates the economy to protect the workers and restrict the owners from these activities. For example, the Manifesto talks about how the workers become effectively slaves of the factory owners, because they are dependent on their wage to live. However, the government can make it so that the workers are entitled to a minimum income, making them more economically stable and have more of a hand in determining their own destinies. The recent Financial reform bill shows how this can work. By passing protections that ensure that workers are not exploited by the upper classes, the government can prevent capitalism from failing.
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